Thanks, B.J. You're pretty close on the estimate...here's their breakdown:

-Remove and Replace Brake Pads and Rotors: $380
-Flush brake system, fill with specified DOT fluid and bleed: $100
-Spec Track Setup Or Customer Requested (Alignment): $125
-Supplies/Hazmat: $24.20

There are all sorts of issues here:

First off, I dropped my car off at 8:15AM. I got a ride with a coworker back to the shop around 12:15PM. At that point, my car was on the lift with the wheels off, but that was all that had been done to it. I walked around for another 1.5-2 hours talking with an owner of an Evo X that was getting an alignment and checking my e-mail. I even talked to Jim when he dropped by. Nothing was done on my car during this time. Then I went up to the customer lounge and waited there until the car was done around 4:15PM. So basically, ~15 minutes in the morning to put the car on the lift and remove the wheels, plus ~2.5 or so hours in the afternoon to do the rest of the work = $380. Even at $95/hour, the labor doesn't add up. I think they may have fixed rates for certain tasks.

Then there's the flush-n-fill. According to the description "fill with specified DOT fluid", it would appear that I was charged for fluid as part of a fixed fee, even though I provided my own ATE fluid.

And the alignment (Spec track setup or customer requested)...I didn't request a spec alignment, I simply asked for stock parameters as I told them I would not be tracking the car anytime soon. Not sure how stock becomes "Spec track Setup"...

The funny thing is, I told the Evo X guy (I think his name was KC or Casey) that he came to the right shop, and that they'd never done wrong by me. He said ForceFed had also recommended APC. Then two hours later I get sticker shock from hell...well, sometimes lessons are hard, and sometimes lessons are expensive. Lesson learned.

 

There are a lot of shops that strictly adhere to alldata, A job take a certain amount of hours to complete....regardless of how long it actually takes. The flush and fill sounds like they charged you labour for doing the actual flush and filling and bleeding regardless of you bringing your own fluid. As for the track spec......Maybe its because the OEM alignment for the Evo is a bit more aggressive then a standard car (I had a shop in GA align my car according to what they thought was normal and I almost killed myself. When I went back there and asked what the hell they argued with me saying if i wanted it more aggressive I should've indicated that to which I said what you say is aggressive is actually stock).

 

You're probably right about alldata, but it didn't cost anywhere near as much the last time I had this done. Also, before I left, they gave me a quote to replace my struts and springs including alignment, and the alignment cost was $95...go figure.

However they break it out, $630 is still WAY too much for a brake job and alignment given that NO materials were provided...

 

I feel you. I recently got some work done to our Forester and I feel like I got got. I'll be looking at some other shops before I got back with those guys.

 

Yeah, me too. It's just too bad...Jim is an awesome guy, and I really like this shop's grasp on performance cars and their drivers.

Seems to me something has changed...I overheard their staff trying to figure out what to charge for certain jobs, and there didn't seem to to be a consensus as to how much to charge for each task. Maybe they're in a state of transition and just screwed me over by accident because they don't know what the hell they're doing anymore...

BTW, I saw your other post asking for a tactrix cable...did you get your car back? I hope so, if anyone around here has a beef, it's you...

 

You guys are absolutely right... Alldata should be used as a rule of thumb and not a actual guideline. We do use it for parts explosions and test procedures but only refer to it for a idea of what to charge on some jobs just because we do such a wide variety or performance/maintenance work sometimes its a fine line on what you should charge for OE or aftermarket stuff. On all the subie, mitsu, Supra stuff we generally have our own flat rate fees that typically are cheaper than what is posted for.

Yes Mike, Casey Cole is a good customer of ours. young cat with a nice white evo. We send people up there from time to time for alignments but even the last 2-3 people we did were not happy at all and complained for days. Sadly we do not do alignments here on scaling and corner balancing. Perhaps I should look into it if this whole property thing works out soon.

 

That's interesting you overheard them trying to figure out what to charge for certain jobs. That is definitely not something they should be talking about near customers. I am willing to assume Jim wouldn't hire techs that didn't know what they were doing BUT that doesn't mean they know how to run the office part of the shop. From what I understand Monica runs the office, answers the phone, paperwork, quotes, etc. Nick, who I've mainly dealt with, does some office work as well but is a tech too. And like I mentioned before Nick seems to be the shop manager.

Alldata makes a ton of $$ for shops/techs. If you are a good tech, you should easily be able to get the job done in close to 1/2 the labor time Alldata says. Depending on the shop, most techs will be paid by the job & if it takes them as long as Alldata says they aren't making any money. Like Hurell said, shops charge what Alldata says but complete the work in half the time. And as Justin said there are good things about Alldata but it shouldn't be used as an actual guideline.

I would think at this point they would be out of their "transition state", so I think there is no mistake on their end, with what they charged you. Lucky for them they probably have some very loyal customers that have been going there for years & will continue to do so no matter what the pricing is.

$100 for the brake flush, fill & bleed probably included fluid (even though you brought your own.) As I mentioned before, they quoted me about $50 for an oil change & that was with me providing the oil & filter.

$95 labor rate is about average. However, $380/$95 = 4 hrs. You were physically there & saw that it only took them around 2.5 hrs or so to do it, not 4 hrs. I would have bi*ched right away if I were you & saw that.

I've been quoted (2) prices for alignments from them, $79 for toe only & $99 for toe & camber. Just charge $90 for a full alignment & be done with it. $20 more to adjust camber...seriously? I don't even see the point of offering a toe only alignment. I am willing to bet almost all cars they do alignments on have toe, camber & maybe even caster adjustments on them.

$125 for a "track spec" alignment, wtf is that?? The factory evo eccentric bolts for the toe & camber will only go so far. So they are literally charging $25 more for them to turn a wrench slightly further. It's like they like have to unbolt a control arm & add/remove shims etc to change camber. The alignment specs I usually request are very simple, 0 toe all around, around -1.8 camber up front & -1 in the rear. Nothing crazy, very simple specs that the OEM eccentric bolts will allow. If they think I am paying an extra $25 for that, they are crazy.

Mike, I would definitely take a trip back over there & see if you can get Jim to come by too. Go over the bill with Jim & Nick and explain everything to them. Of course we aren't expecting Jiffy Lube type quickness/service & pricing as we obviously care about our cars but I consider this borderline price gouging.

As mentioned before, I like Jim & I like APC but the quotes I have recently received & hearing stories from other locals will keep me away. It is obvious a lot of us in this thread are or were customers & have also recommended the shop to others. I hope Jim gets a chance to read over this & takes into consideration what we have to say.

 

Thanks for all the support, guys! The only thing better than the Evo as a car is the community that it brings together.

 

Yeah Mike I got the car back. My AC problem was ROM related. So when AC is on the car wants to die. Told Spec-Ops my findings. Just waiting on a time to bring it back to work out that small snag.

I get most of my maintenance done at Turbotime and anytime they have had to get an alignment done (IE when they do anything with suspension components) they use importmotor werkes just down the road from them. Their prices are reasonable ($85 bux) and they seem fairly knowledgeable when it comes to performance cars (even if they specialize in Euro cars).

Its funny the shop that screwed me on my Blue Evo was in Atlanta and run by a person I consider a friend and I ALWAYS used to hear him quote AllData time when work needed to be done. I understand that the better a tech is the quicker he can turn a job around the incentive is for him to turn as many hours as he can in a day and the skills required to do so should not be a negative (IE only get paid for hours actually worked) but on the same token some of the labor in AllData's system is pretty stretched out and doesn't take into account a mechanic that knows the platform inside and out and can do something with their eyes closed. Seems to me there should be some sort of balance to be fair to both the customer and the business.

Oh well either way......when the hell is FF coming to Raleigh? #jussayin. :P

 

Anyone local interested in a beast, low mileage Evo 9 Stock Turbo?? I sent it out to FP for them to install their 84mm compressor cover. FP also inspected & balanced the turbo while it was there, will provide paperwork. Hotside is EXTREMELY ported by Collin@Toxicfab & was Titanium Ceramic Coated by Justin@DetectiveCoating.

Hotside is from the stock turbo World Record Car, 10.02ET.

I can provide more pics for someone interested.

Original plan was to throw this on my 2.3 setup & see how far I could push it but I decided to just go straight to my FP Zephyr.

I have a couple, very interested, buyers that I would need to ship to. I would prefer to deal locally, if possible, so I don't have to deal with paypal fees or shipping.

 

You guys see this thread, anyone know who it is??

https://www.evolutionm.net/forums/pr...nnovation.html

 

Crazy, I hadn't seen that! I think he came in this thread to introduce himself recently and said he'd posted a build thread, but he didn't provide a link. I'm assuming this is it.

I think it's a cool idea and I'm definitely subscribing. My wife works with the sanctioning body that handles the EV Rally's that are held each year in NC, and I've always been fascinated at what people (particularly school/college kids) can do with electric vehicles. The fact that someone's doing it with an Evo makes it that much sweeter!

Thanks for posting this, B.J.!

 

Good grief, this place is D-E-A-D dead!

 

no joke.... BJ what up need to hit up that boxcar bar again

 

Funny you mentioned that, we have friends coming in town from NJ the weekend of 9/12 & we plan on taking them there.

Have to go to a wedding out of state this weekend. And our 1 yr wedding anniversary is next weekend. As of right now we are heading to the beach next weekend.