Evo IX dynoed at Top Level Auto 435hp 437tq stock turbo
Dec 23, 2006, 07:15 PM
#257
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Thanks for the support Steve
, we just want to give our contribution to evom and im not here to deceive anybody, we have some projects we are workin on for next year. There will be dyno numbers and time slips so we can discuss im always open to new ideas, becuase u learn something new everyday and we also are willin to help when we can. This dyno number the car did the car was pushed way past normal limits "we know that" but thats what the customer wanted and was to run really high boost to see whats the max this turbo could do. Like most shops we do get some of the mad scientist type customers who want to push the limits so he did and that was the number, now can this car hold 34 35psi?
nooooooo but your not goin to know unless u try right? and thats what this guy wanted to do and thats to see how the car reacts and drives at that boost level.
We told him running 28psi to 29psi with meth on the dyno would be ideal for his mods but he wanted more boost, he wanted to see for himself instead of hearing "Mr Talon & friends" on there keyboards say it wont work, so i give him credit for wanting to keep trying to get the most out of his car till he gets his new turbo set up
, we just want to give our contribution to evom and im not here to deceive anybody, we have some projects we are workin on for next year. There will be dyno numbers and time slips so we can discuss im always open to new ideas, becuase u learn something new everyday and we also are willin to help when we can. This dyno number the car did the car was pushed way past normal limits "we know that" but thats what the customer wanted and was to run really high boost to see whats the max this turbo could do. Like most shops we do get some of the mad scientist type customers who want to push the limits so he did and that was the number, now can this car hold 34 35psi?nooooooo but your not goin to know unless u try right? and thats what this guy wanted to do and thats to see how the car reacts and drives at that boost level.
We told him running 28psi to 29psi with meth on the dyno would be ideal for his mods but he wanted more boost, he wanted to see for himself instead of hearing "Mr Talon & friends" on there keyboards say it wont work, so i give him credit for wanting to keep trying to get the most out of his car till he gets his new turbo set up
whoa whoa whoa, dude, give them a chance to breathe. It may sound crazy but these guys do know what they're doing. They've already done things with evos that no one else has done.
The car trapping 113 obviously proves it wasnt making 435whp when it was ran at the track. THESE GUYS HAVE NO REASON TO LIE, AND WHY WOULD THEY POST UP THOSE TIMES AFTER POSTING THAT DYNO SHEET IF THEY WERE LYING??? THEY KNOW THAT 113MPH=330-340WHP.
I also dont understand why people think there is some setting on the dyno to just add in whatever HP you want to the sheet. Contrary to what any of you guys think, there is not an option for that, or at least not on any dyno i've seen.
The correction factor is what changes numbers and they are using the same factor as turbotrix, very similar to most peoples dynojets. The car has basically every bolt on with methanol and i'm SURE it was running well over 30 psi, or at least spiking around 33-34. thats why the torque number is so high, the HP is high but its not astronomically crazy.
Chris here at the shop made 380whp with just TBE/MBC/lower pipe/Meth kit on a reflash RUNNING ONLY 25 PSI!!!. when he got tuned he didnt have the correct spring in the MBC and once he changed it and turned it up to 30, the car was noticeably making more power, enough to blow the clutch without even launching it. i'd imagine around 390whp/400wtq. Top levels car was tuned to the limit and has cams, o2 housing, fmic, piping, dli2 and its spiking to higher boost.
And one last thing, my 2005 evo on methanol made 380whp and i had a defi bf amber boost gauge and it buried well past 2.0bar and by redline in 3rd anf 4th i was around 1.7 bar. thats about 25-26 psi. WARRTALON, we dont spike to 27-28 and then drop off over here in NY, we spike to 33-34 and drop off to 25-28.
The car trapping 113 obviously proves it wasnt making 435whp when it was ran at the track. THESE GUYS HAVE NO REASON TO LIE, AND WHY WOULD THEY POST UP THOSE TIMES AFTER POSTING THAT DYNO SHEET IF THEY WERE LYING??? THEY KNOW THAT 113MPH=330-340WHP.
I also dont understand why people think there is some setting on the dyno to just add in whatever HP you want to the sheet. Contrary to what any of you guys think, there is not an option for that, or at least not on any dyno i've seen.
The correction factor is what changes numbers and they are using the same factor as turbotrix, very similar to most peoples dynojets. The car has basically every bolt on with methanol and i'm SURE it was running well over 30 psi, or at least spiking around 33-34. thats why the torque number is so high, the HP is high but its not astronomically crazy.
Chris here at the shop made 380whp with just TBE/MBC/lower pipe/Meth kit on a reflash RUNNING ONLY 25 PSI!!!. when he got tuned he didnt have the correct spring in the MBC and once he changed it and turned it up to 30, the car was noticeably making more power, enough to blow the clutch without even launching it. i'd imagine around 390whp/400wtq. Top levels car was tuned to the limit and has cams, o2 housing, fmic, piping, dli2 and its spiking to higher boost.
And one last thing, my 2005 evo on methanol made 380whp and i had a defi bf amber boost gauge and it buried well past 2.0bar and by redline in 3rd anf 4th i was around 1.7 bar. thats about 25-26 psi. WARRTALON, we dont spike to 27-28 and then drop off over here in NY, we spike to 33-34 and drop off to 25-28.
Dec 23, 2006, 07:18 PM
#258
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I don't really know the car here, but i ve done some work at TLP and i really like the guys... Very friendly and discuss and explain everything...
As far as their Dynojet numbers is concerned, it works like any other dynojet and i can support the above statement with FACTS...
Today i dynoed my car on a Dyno Dynamics and i saw 298 at the wheels. The Dyno Dynamics, according to the Shop shows 12% lower than the Dynojets... So converting the above numbers to Dynojet numbers i get 334 at the wheels, which is PRETTY DAMN close to the 328 that i saw at Top Levels dyno exactly seven days ago, which actually was a hotter day and i didn't have the Walbro on...
Their numbers are correct...
As far as their Dynojet numbers is concerned, it works like any other dynojet and i can support the above statement with FACTS...
Today i dynoed my car on a Dyno Dynamics and i saw 298 at the wheels. The Dyno Dynamics, according to the Shop shows 12% lower than the Dynojets... So converting the above numbers to Dynojet numbers i get 334 at the wheels, which is PRETTY DAMN close to the 328 that i saw at Top Levels dyno exactly seven days ago, which actually was a hotter day and i didn't have the Walbro on...
Their numbers are correct...
Dec 24, 2006, 04:06 PM
#259
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Thanks John 
, this dynojet is no different then other dynojets. Anybody like i mentioned before, can dyno there car here and then dyno at another dynojet and u wont see much of a difference.
, this dynojet is no different then other dynojets. Anybody like i mentioned before, can dyno there car here and then dyno at another dynojet and u wont see much of a difference. I don't really know the car here, but i ve done some work at TLP and i really like the guys... Very friendly and discuss and explain everything...
As far as their Dynojet numbers is concerned, it works like any other dynojet and i can support the above statement with FACTS...
Today i dynoed my car on a Dyno Dynamics and i saw 298 at the wheels. The Dyno Dynamics, according to the Shop shows 12% lower than the Dynojets... So converting the above numbers to Dynojet numbers i get 334 at the wheels, which is PRETTY DAMN close to the 328 that i saw at Top Levels dyno exactly seven days ago, which actually was a hotter day and i didn't have the Walbro on...
Their numbers are correct...
As far as their Dynojet numbers is concerned, it works like any other dynojet and i can support the above statement with FACTS...
Today i dynoed my car on a Dyno Dynamics and i saw 298 at the wheels. The Dyno Dynamics, according to the Shop shows 12% lower than the Dynojets... So converting the above numbers to Dynojet numbers i get 334 at the wheels, which is PRETTY DAMN close to the 328 that i saw at Top Levels dyno exactly seven days ago, which actually was a hotter day and i didn't have the Walbro on...
Their numbers are correct...
Dec 25, 2006, 12:14 PM
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this thread is such a sad shame because the guys are Top Level are such good guys and they really do know so much and they really do just have a genuine interest in making cars go fast. They are not stupid by any means or looking to deceive. Why would they post up these numbers then post up a trap speed of 113??? they CAN DO MATH GUYS!!! they know the car didnt run what it should have but that happens all the time. 75% of cars that run at the track DO NOT run what they expect to. Anyone ever realize that?
I do alot of business with Top Level because they are Semi-Local to me and we've formed a very good relationship with them both professionally and personally. I hate to see alot of the people in thread ranting and making them look bad when thjey really do know what they're doing. They've already isntalled a evo 9 motor in an 8 and vice versa, they've done things that I see people talking about doing 6 months later. They were doing ACD clutch swaps in 2004 when the first 05 evos had just came out and people were paying 1000$ for clutch jobs at the dealer.
Warrtalon, please dont tell me that my defi BF boost gauge was 9-10 psi off because I just dont believe it. Your gonna say my car was dropping off to 17 psi and telling me 25-27? I'm sorry I just dont believe that mine, Chris my coworker and my friend/customers kyle's evos' were all doing the same thing and saying the same thing. We all made 380whp on stock turbos with meth injection and were all spiking to well over 30 psi. Maybe its NY thing as you say it is
I do alot of business with Top Level because they are Semi-Local to me and we've formed a very good relationship with them both professionally and personally. I hate to see alot of the people in thread ranting and making them look bad when thjey really do know what they're doing. They've already isntalled a evo 9 motor in an 8 and vice versa, they've done things that I see people talking about doing 6 months later. They were doing ACD clutch swaps in 2004 when the first 05 evos had just came out and people were paying 1000$ for clutch jobs at the dealer.
Warrtalon, please dont tell me that my defi BF boost gauge was 9-10 psi off because I just dont believe it. Your gonna say my car was dropping off to 17 psi and telling me 25-27? I'm sorry I just dont believe that mine, Chris my coworker and my friend/customers kyle's evos' were all doing the same thing and saying the same thing. We all made 380whp on stock turbos with meth injection and were all spiking to well over 30 psi. Maybe its NY thing as you say it is
Dec 25, 2006, 04:22 PM
#263
No, the tune is not all the work - that's a foolish thing to say. Their tuning is not magical - power doesn't come from nowhere.
As for The Shop, you're wrong, kouzman. Yes, DynoDynamics dynos USUALLY read very low, but for whatever reason, the one at The Shop reads just like a Dynojet. It in no way reads like the Buschur Mustang Dyno. I don't know why, but it's not even an argument - it's already been shown many times to read just like a Dynojet.
Hey, Steve, if you want to believe your eyes watching a boost gauge in 3rd gear at 7k instead of relying on a MAP sensor showing the TRUE boost, then be my guest. There's nothing special about your 380whp on those mods, so I don't know why you keep bringing it up, but in no way proves you maintain 25+ psi at redline. There are Evos making more power and running MUCH faster at the track than you and everyone you listed, and none of them maintain 25psi at 7k. Believe what you want to believe, but I prefer to trust proven data sources (e.g. MAP sensor) and actual track results. You keep saying, "why would they post the 113mph traps after posting these dyno results?" as if it's some saving grace, but you completely fail to realize that we've been hounding these guys for months after promises of track PROOF and also that there were multiple EvoM people AT THE TRACK, so it's not like they had a choice of not revealing the results. That would have been even worse than claiming a ridiculous 435whp on such few mods then only proving ~335whp at the track.
As for The Shop, you're wrong, kouzman. Yes, DynoDynamics dynos USUALLY read very low, but for whatever reason, the one at The Shop reads just like a Dynojet. It in no way reads like the Buschur Mustang Dyno. I don't know why, but it's not even an argument - it's already been shown many times to read just like a Dynojet.
Hey, Steve, if you want to believe your eyes watching a boost gauge in 3rd gear at 7k instead of relying on a MAP sensor showing the TRUE boost, then be my guest. There's nothing special about your 380whp on those mods, so I don't know why you keep bringing it up, but in no way proves you maintain 25+ psi at redline. There are Evos making more power and running MUCH faster at the track than you and everyone you listed, and none of them maintain 25psi at 7k. Believe what you want to believe, but I prefer to trust proven data sources (e.g. MAP sensor) and actual track results. You keep saying, "why would they post the 113mph traps after posting these dyno results?" as if it's some saving grace, but you completely fail to realize that we've been hounding these guys for months after promises of track PROOF and also that there were multiple EvoM people AT THE TRACK, so it's not like they had a choice of not revealing the results. That would have been even worse than claiming a ridiculous 435whp on such few mods then only proving ~335whp at the track.
Dec 25, 2006, 09:11 PM
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First off this guy has a life and works for a living, your hounding didnt make him go to the track, he always planned to go to the track but didnt have time and if there were so many people there that would of posted the numbers, then why did u and anybody else who kept askin for updates all day didnt get any numbers posted from those all there? nobody knew which car it was, u said it your self 12 hours and nothing yet, so in that 12 hours how come number body posted numbers Mr Talon? then he came after 10pm and posted his numbers.
No, the tune is not all the work - that's a foolish thing to say. Their tuning is not magical - power doesn't come from nowhere.
As for The Shop, you're wrong, kouzman. Yes, DynoDynamics dynos USUALLY read very low, but for whatever reason, the one at The Shop reads just like a Dynojet. It in no way reads like the Buschur Mustang Dyno. I don't know why, but it's not even an argument - it's already been shown many times to read just like a Dynojet.
Hey, Steve, if you want to believe your eyes watching a boost gauge in 3rd gear at 7k instead of relying on a MAP sensor showing the TRUE boost, then be my guest. There's nothing special about your 380whp on those mods, so I don't know why you keep bringing it up, but in no way proves you maintain 25+ psi at redline. There are Evos making more power and running MUCH faster at the track than you and everyone you listed, and none of them maintain 25psi at 7k. Believe what you want to believe, but I prefer to trust proven data sources (e.g. MAP sensor) and actual track results. You keep saying, "why would they post the 113mph traps after posting these dyno results?" as if it's some saving grace, but you completely fail to realize that we've been hounding these guys for months after promises of track PROOF and also that there were multiple EvoM people AT THE TRACK, so it's not like they had a choice of not revealing the results. That would have been even worse than claiming a ridiculous 435whp on such few mods then only proving ~335whp at the track.
As for The Shop, you're wrong, kouzman. Yes, DynoDynamics dynos USUALLY read very low, but for whatever reason, the one at The Shop reads just like a Dynojet. It in no way reads like the Buschur Mustang Dyno. I don't know why, but it's not even an argument - it's already been shown many times to read just like a Dynojet.
Hey, Steve, if you want to believe your eyes watching a boost gauge in 3rd gear at 7k instead of relying on a MAP sensor showing the TRUE boost, then be my guest. There's nothing special about your 380whp on those mods, so I don't know why you keep bringing it up, but in no way proves you maintain 25+ psi at redline. There are Evos making more power and running MUCH faster at the track than you and everyone you listed, and none of them maintain 25psi at 7k. Believe what you want to believe, but I prefer to trust proven data sources (e.g. MAP sensor) and actual track results. You keep saying, "why would they post the 113mph traps after posting these dyno results?" as if it's some saving grace, but you completely fail to realize that we've been hounding these guys for months after promises of track PROOF and also that there were multiple EvoM people AT THE TRACK, so it's not like they had a choice of not revealing the results. That would have been even worse than claiming a ridiculous 435whp on such few mods then only proving ~335whp at the track.
Dec 25, 2006, 10:13 PM
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Warrtalon, I know this sounds crazy, but everyone on this forum doesnt revolve their life around what people say and ask for on here. I doubt the guy was thinking about what he was going to say when his car ran the numbers it did.
And still all the people in this thread claiming the dyno read wrong, how did it read wrong? How did they increase the numbers without modifying the correction factor? You cant just type in whatever you want, it doesnt work like that.
AND i still dont get why you keep saying they are a new shop or new to any of this. They've been building evos since they came out dude, its not new to them at all. I dont care if they're new to this forum or not, they are not new to working on this specific car. They posted these numbers because they new the car made great great numbers. I know they are high but I feel that they are not SOO high that its completely unbelieveable. My co worker chris's car made 381whp on an evo 9 with BS mods. Intake/tbe/mbc/alky/walbro pump/lower pipe. Stock cams, stock fmic, stock upper piping, stock o2 housing. AND THAT WAS ON 25 PSI!!! he then put the heavier spring in the boost controller and raised the boost to 30+ and the car was noticeable even faster. For it to actually feel faster i'm sure its making 390-395 now. Now add cams, o2 housing and an intercooler and a retune and you think 40 more whp is completely impossible??? I mean yea its high but since i know these guys as well as I do, i just cant imagine them lying. They also have an evo race car with 600+ whp and it hasnt been tuned to the max yet.
And still all the people in this thread claiming the dyno read wrong, how did it read wrong? How did they increase the numbers without modifying the correction factor? You cant just type in whatever you want, it doesnt work like that.
AND i still dont get why you keep saying they are a new shop or new to any of this. They've been building evos since they came out dude, its not new to them at all. I dont care if they're new to this forum or not, they are not new to working on this specific car. They posted these numbers because they new the car made great great numbers. I know they are high but I feel that they are not SOO high that its completely unbelieveable. My co worker chris's car made 381whp on an evo 9 with BS mods. Intake/tbe/mbc/alky/walbro pump/lower pipe. Stock cams, stock fmic, stock upper piping, stock o2 housing. AND THAT WAS ON 25 PSI!!! he then put the heavier spring in the boost controller and raised the boost to 30+ and the car was noticeable even faster. For it to actually feel faster i'm sure its making 390-395 now. Now add cams, o2 housing and an intercooler and a retune and you think 40 more whp is completely impossible??? I mean yea its high but since i know these guys as well as I do, i just cant imagine them lying. They also have an evo race car with 600+ whp and it hasnt been tuned to the max yet.
Dec 26, 2006, 09:59 AM
#268
No, the tune is not all the work - that's a foolish thing to say. Their tuning is not magical - power doesn't come from nowhere.
As for The Shop, you're wrong, kouzman. Yes, DynoDynamics dynos USUALLY read very low, but for whatever reason, the one at The Shop reads just like a Dynojet. It in no way reads like the Buschur Mustang Dyno. I don't know why, but it's not even an argument - it's already been shown many times to read just like a Dynojet.
Hey, Steve, if you want to believe your eyes watching a boost gauge in 3rd gear at 7k instead of relying on a MAP sensor showing the TRUE boost, then be my guest. There's nothing special about your 380whp on those mods, so I don't know why you keep bringing it up, but in no way proves you maintain 25+ psi at redline. There are Evos making more power and running MUCH faster at the track than you and everyone you listed, and none of them maintain 25psi at 7k. Believe what you want to believe, but I prefer to trust proven data sources (e.g. MAP sensor) and actual track results. You keep saying, "why would they post the 113mph traps after posting these dyno results?" as if it's some saving grace, but you completely fail to realize that we've been hounding these guys for months after promises of track PROOF and also that there were multiple EvoM people AT THE TRACK, so it's not like they had a choice of not revealing the results. That would have been even worse than claiming a ridiculous 435whp on such few mods then only proving ~335whp at the track.
As for The Shop, you're wrong, kouzman. Yes, DynoDynamics dynos USUALLY read very low, but for whatever reason, the one at The Shop reads just like a Dynojet. It in no way reads like the Buschur Mustang Dyno. I don't know why, but it's not even an argument - it's already been shown many times to read just like a Dynojet.
Hey, Steve, if you want to believe your eyes watching a boost gauge in 3rd gear at 7k instead of relying on a MAP sensor showing the TRUE boost, then be my guest. There's nothing special about your 380whp on those mods, so I don't know why you keep bringing it up, but in no way proves you maintain 25+ psi at redline. There are Evos making more power and running MUCH faster at the track than you and everyone you listed, and none of them maintain 25psi at 7k. Believe what you want to believe, but I prefer to trust proven data sources (e.g. MAP sensor) and actual track results. You keep saying, "why would they post the 113mph traps after posting these dyno results?" as if it's some saving grace, but you completely fail to realize that we've been hounding these guys for months after promises of track PROOF and also that there were multiple EvoM people AT THE TRACK, so it's not like they had a choice of not revealing the results. That would have been even worse than claiming a ridiculous 435whp on such few mods then only proving ~335whp at the track.
Dec 26, 2006, 11:56 AM
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warrtalon- the reason the shops dyno is reading closer to dynojets is because Dyno Dynamics is changed the calibration of their dynos recently and the newest ones read higher, We have the same one coming and the DD rep told us that.
-Steve
-Steve
Dec 26, 2006, 12:45 PM
#270
AND i still dont get why you keep saying they are a new shop or new to any of this. They've been building evos since they came out dude, its not new to them at all. I dont care if they're new to this forum or not, they are not new to working on this specific car.
A Whole Three years?
I believe Warrtalon's gripe is with the massive Dyno Numbers and the Poor track times. He is also contesting the ability of the stock turbo to hold 28PSI until redline.
Top Level Auto stated that they observed 28PSI until redline via a Defi D Boost Gauge, which Warrtalon had also stated is highly innacurate and only a Map reading would suffice. Generally these mechanial boost gauges aren't that accurate while a MAP is dead on every time. In fact it often shows how innacurate the boost gauge is. Warr may be an *** about it, but I feel his questions and challenges are relevant. I personally don't believe the 28PSI at Red Line, if I saw a MPA reading I would, but I won't attack them for it, let them show what they can do.
Last edited by High_PSI; Dec 26, 2006 at 12:50 PM.