chrisw

iTrader: (2)

So 2 weeks ago now I had sent my very tired ohlins off to Colorado to have them upgraded to the latest specification. The turn around time was less than a week, this included 2nd day delivery in both directions, and the actual service itself.

My poor old ohlins were tired, in fact Joe (the rebuilder) commented that while cronohunter was hard on his ohlins, mine were by far the worst set that he has rebuilt so far. I'll admit that these struts had a worse ride than a stock set of '03 struts, they were that bad... umm, brick on a roller skate comes to mind when looking for the analogy that fits the ride.

Joe is an excellent dealer to work with, he was able to answer all my questions and by our conversation over the phone, he was able to valve the struts just where I needed them for the autocross abuse I put them through. Not only did Joe diagnose my setup needs, he also provided valuble information on how to setup the Evo so I get the correct roll centers, ride height and alignment details. All this information has proven to be very helpful in determining what I need to do to get the car setup for a given event.

So while I have not had the time to get a decent corner weight and proper alignment, I have had a local shop put a generic alignment and I have roughly setup the right ride heights.

Front:
525lbs spring
-2.9 camber
4.9 caster
1/8" toe out

Rear:
600lbs spring
-1.3 camber
0 toe

swaybars are on full soft at this point.



THE STREET RIDE
Very compliant with a smooth ride on all but the biggest, baddest, potholes you can't avoid hitting. My spring rates are about 100 lbs higher than what is recommened, but I do that strictly for autocross's high transition rates. For such a stiff valving, the ride is very good and easy on the kidneys for daily driving.

THE AUTOCROSS
Today's autocross was held at candleStick park in SF. The surface is old tarmac, grip is consistantly good, but the surface is very bumpy, perfect for those "damm rally cars" I have always enjoyed candlestick and my of the evo and subie drivers in the SFR region agree that it's one of our favorites.

The course was a longish 65 second course. When I left, TOD was in the 65-64 range, with many of the top driver having run. My best time was a 68.4 clean, with a faster time of 67.9 +1 Keep in mind that I am on a new alignment, new settings, and the car is handling very different from what I am used to (crappy old scheitt). The course had a little bit of everything, some tight lane changes, a fairly decent slalom and the back section which had some long S corners going into the finsh, not to mention the car breaking bumps (candlestick is known to break cars)

With the toe out, the car has a really sharp turn in going into a corner. On my first run, I imediately noticed mid corner understeer, something I have never had before. I was able to tune this out by lowering the front presures, and going to a stiffer setting on the ohlins. Once that was figured out, the next big improvement that I noticed was how the rear end was handling... With this new valving, the rear of the car goes exactly where the front was pointed. In the tight lane changes, the back of the car would literally flick itself through the corner to the point where I could take the lane change without lifting In the sweepers, I could feel the back end start to rotate (not enough for me) but I need to tune the suspension more to get the rotation I want. In the slalom, I could almost keep the throttle at a steady state (aprox 60%) while negotiating the gates.
Wheel spin from lifting the inside rear was greatly reduced. Candlestick is far to bumpy for me to determine how much the wheel lift has been reduced. My first impression is that it has been reduced, but coming off some tired ohlins to these, I would expect that to be true.

Overall I am very satisfied with the ohlins at this point. If you want a winning setup, sell what ever coilovers you are using, and buy these ohlins through Vishnu. For the money, you can't go wrong...

Paul (cronohunter), make sure you buy Joe a for me. He definately deserves it.

Now I need to get a decent corner weight and alignment, and maybe I can start to close the gap to Vic Sias (SM national champ).

Thanks to all of those who made this possible, keep up the good work. Oh yeah, the correct analogy for the vishnu/gerrard spec ohlins is more like "a brike on a roller blade" where the old tired ohlins were on roller skates with metal wheels

Dustin@Vishnu

iTrader: (1)

I noticed that my car has a more pronounced understeer running 1/8th toe out in the front, unless I am running a full 3 degrees of camber. If you are running less than 3 degrees up front, I would recommend only going with a 1/16th of toe out in the front. While 1/8th feels great for turn in, it can cause mid-corner push, if you aren't running the camber to support it.

chrisw

iTrader: (2)

yeah I thought of that, but the problem with going over -3 is you greatly affect the straight line acceleration and braking. My tire temps also indicate that -3 is overkill. I was able to dial out the understeer by changing the valving, and dropping the front tire presure by 2lbs

chronohunter

iTrader: (1)

Chris thanks for the great review Joe does indeed do a nice job (he is very meticulous).

Also good job tuning out the understeer, there is considerable range within the valving so you will feel each click affect the car (good and bad ).

A couple of thoughts about camber. I brought up the negative effects of "excessive camber" on acceleration and breaking to a top professional chassis engineer, he just rolled his eyes at me and suggested next time we test that we would run through the range of camber and check it against data and lap times.

Results...he was right and I was dead wrong. the car simply went faster and faster as we increased camber and caster finally maxing out at a big number where the car did not go any quicker. The temp spread went over 60 degrees from inside to outside (so we used asymmetrical cambers to keep the inside tires tire temps in the window). There were NO discernible differences in breaking or accelerating looking at the data, the car just plain liked it and went quicker. Speed is mainly dependent on apex speed (over entry and exit) so you have to make that the set-up priority.

Remember strut cars have no real camber gain and when they are lowered they may have camber loss. That is why you run seemingly ridiculous amounts of static negative camber.

Happy driving

chrisw

iTrader: (2)

interesting, but I would not want to run -3 for prolonged periods on the street (I like my new tires)

I wish I could totally apply what your engineer said, but the EVO is still a daily driver. I have to stop modd'ing it and get a tow vehicle...

Dustin@Vishnu

iTrader: (1)

You should set up two markings on your tie rods, and your camber plates. On my car, the first one is for -1.7 and the second one is for -3.0. The day before I go to the track, I put the car up, and change it over. It takes about 15 mins a side.

donour

iTrader: (6)

We found the same thing in the FSAE car. Even though the car spends most of it's acceleration time traction (not power) limited, the loss in grip from radical camber is well less than the variance of the tractional control system and driver's right foot. The added speed mid-corner makes up for it. It was a pretty neat experiment to do because the FSAE car makes it so easy to set camber, caster, and toe to whatever angles you can dream up.

d

speedomodel

iTrader: (15)

Hmm, so you had time to write this detailed review but not the time to get "a decent corner weight and proper alignment" done. Seriously, the Vishnu Ohlins really do sound like the real deal.

tuner

iTrader: (4)

It was nice to finally meet you Chris. Were you the fastest of the Evos and STIs? It looked like you were the 3rd fastest overall when we had to leave. That 427 Cobra was a monster! We'll come out with my Evo and our Ariel Atom soon. It was fun showing off the Atom, it gets always gets tons of attention.

mmoranda

iTrader: (24)

Hey Bill I think you have your own thread on norcal evo.
http://www.norcalevo.net/forum/index...c,10255.0.html

Atom should be an awesome autox car.

tuner

iTrader: (4)

mmoranda;

Yeah I just found the Atom thread on the other forum. Didn't know it was there. Not to highjack this great discussion on the Ohlins I started a new thread here on the Atom:

https://www.evolutionm.net/forums/sh...d.php?t=207306

chrisw

iTrader: (2)

I don't know yet, the times have not been posted. But, since all the STI's are still on street tires, I expect to be on top.. I won SM yesterday, I don't know how I PAX'ed or where I finished overall.

Nice meeting you, I love that atom. Wish I had one in my garage (if I had a garage that is)