Vishnu Ohlins are here!
Apr 30, 2007, 02:05 PM
#196
Luffy: Know you know how I feel, I've been waiting for these shocks since when they were 1st announced. I even collected all the parts necessary for the damn setup.
jcnel_evo8: A lot of the story is correct and I'm trying to see if Vishnu can find another shop/person to do the revalves. The dampening rates are all Vishnu's proprietary information and only Vishnu's. But it seems the guys at Vishnu were left out cold after Joe and Robbie from CSU left. I was offered a refund since it's taking so long and there didn't seem to be an immediate solution but what good is that going to do me when I already bought all the necessary parts.
Calvin@Vishnu has been very helpful and seems to genuinely care. The rest seems to be too busy testing and R&Ding BMWs. The info is solely theirs because Vishnu paid/sponsored the whole thing ... My discussion basically went like this, why can't they just have someone else besides Joe and Robbie do the revalves? Why are they/us basically being held hostage with proprietary info that belongs to Vishnu anyways? I got the feeling, Robbie is too busy with his current job to be able to do the revalves. For the time being I will be patient ... but those grapes might actually start to look sour after a while, although I hope not ...
Those who want this are people that have bought into Chronohunter's suspension design. All my friends are telling me how unacceptable this is and to go for something else. Mueller, Robi, GTWorx ... I'll find out by today what I'm going to do for sure ...
jcnel_evo8: A lot of the story is correct and I'm trying to see if Vishnu can find another shop/person to do the revalves. The dampening rates are all Vishnu's proprietary information and only Vishnu's. But it seems the guys at Vishnu were left out cold after Joe and Robbie from CSU left. I was offered a refund since it's taking so long and there didn't seem to be an immediate solution but what good is that going to do me when I already bought all the necessary parts.
Calvin@Vishnu has been very helpful and seems to genuinely care. The rest seems to be too busy testing and R&Ding BMWs. The info is solely theirs because Vishnu paid/sponsored the whole thing ... My discussion basically went like this, why can't they just have someone else besides Joe and Robbie do the revalves? Why are they/us basically being held hostage with proprietary info that belongs to Vishnu anyways? I got the feeling, Robbie is too busy with his current job to be able to do the revalves. For the time being I will be patient ... but those grapes might actually start to look sour after a while, although I hope not ...
Those who want this are people that have bought into Chronohunter's suspension design. All my friends are telling me how unacceptable this is and to go for something else. Mueller, Robi, GTWorx ... I'll find out by today what I'm going to do for sure ...
Last edited by DaWorstPlaya; Apr 30, 2007 at 03:22 PM.
Apr 30, 2007, 03:18 PM
#197
To put up what I've seen developed over the past few years this is how it came down:
-- Paul put in some Ohlins (not quite sure which) but revalved a bit to his theory on what needed to happen on the EVO for the 2004 One Lap of America. First in class win.
-- The suspension showed great potential, so Paul linked up sometime with the university he was supporting and allowed some of the student / engineering assistants / techs. to basically do some down and dirty analysis on both the EVO chassis and suspension revalves. This included computerized analysis, to shock dyno time all the way to on-track time.
-- Paul would continue this program refining the Road and Track Ohlins with better and more refined damping rates.
-- Vishnu released a package which consisted of all of the parts Paul needed to make a plug and play system. Shocks, bushings, revalve, and settings.
-- Ohlins ran into supply problems and Vishnu had to pull the product and backtrack for those that had already ordered the Ohlins. Read here: OHLINS'S FAULT, not VISHNU'S FAULT.
-- Paul is now involved with a racing school as a professional employee there, and obviously the student team members from the university are graduating / moving onto other projects.
There are two key points here, one that leads to the other, but here's the scoop.
Idea One:
-- Get Ohlins, and the original team to revalve. This is a supply issue. Ohlins doesn't care about ones and twos revalves. They sell commercially and to major race teams. Its sad, but we need somebody like Fox to step back up again and get some dampers "for the little guy."
-- The damping rates, real life testing, and durability have been tested on the Ohlins.
Idea Two:
-- Transfer over the damping rates to a new shock. Here are the drawbacks:
-- Paul is working for somebody else so his time to find another suitable replacement is extremely limited.
-- The team that did the first empirical work is I think gone. Members of that team will have to speak for themselves, but I'm not quite sure if Joe is in contact with Paul any longer for work that Paul would be able to do? Some of this equation is more than just putting in 'damping' elements.
-- Another plug on this idea is getting another shop somehow somewhere to foot the R&D to produce another shock. I think we're popping the idea about this here, and I hope something is becoming of this, but first ... those damping rates and what Paul did and found is certainly proprietary information. That's the real value in that system.
Hopefully something can be worked out.
~j.
-- Paul put in some Ohlins (not quite sure which) but revalved a bit to his theory on what needed to happen on the EVO for the 2004 One Lap of America. First in class win.
-- The suspension showed great potential, so Paul linked up sometime with the university he was supporting and allowed some of the student / engineering assistants / techs. to basically do some down and dirty analysis on both the EVO chassis and suspension revalves. This included computerized analysis, to shock dyno time all the way to on-track time.
-- Paul would continue this program refining the Road and Track Ohlins with better and more refined damping rates.
-- Vishnu released a package which consisted of all of the parts Paul needed to make a plug and play system. Shocks, bushings, revalve, and settings.
-- Ohlins ran into supply problems and Vishnu had to pull the product and backtrack for those that had already ordered the Ohlins. Read here: OHLINS'S FAULT, not VISHNU'S FAULT.
-- Paul is now involved with a racing school as a professional employee there, and obviously the student team members from the university are graduating / moving onto other projects.
There are two key points here, one that leads to the other, but here's the scoop.
Idea One:
-- Get Ohlins, and the original team to revalve. This is a supply issue. Ohlins doesn't care about ones and twos revalves. They sell commercially and to major race teams. Its sad, but we need somebody like Fox to step back up again and get some dampers "for the little guy."
-- The damping rates, real life testing, and durability have been tested on the Ohlins.
Idea Two:
-- Transfer over the damping rates to a new shock. Here are the drawbacks:
-- Paul is working for somebody else so his time to find another suitable replacement is extremely limited.
-- The team that did the first empirical work is I think gone. Members of that team will have to speak for themselves, but I'm not quite sure if Joe is in contact with Paul any longer for work that Paul would be able to do? Some of this equation is more than just putting in 'damping' elements.
-- Another plug on this idea is getting another shop somehow somewhere to foot the R&D to produce another shock. I think we're popping the idea about this here, and I hope something is becoming of this, but first ... those damping rates and what Paul did and found is certainly proprietary information. That's the real value in that system.
Hopefully something can be worked out.
~j.
Apr 30, 2007, 06:48 PM
#198
Would there be a market for multi-time National champion-spec autocross suspension? I can tell you that from what I've heard about Chronohunter's setup this should perform very similarly. Of course it is optimized for autocross, but I know it will do equally as well on the road course. I hope to prove that later this year at some NASA events.
This Ohlins setup also has many many hours of R+D and computer modeling and shock dyno tuning over a period of more than 3 years. If there is a big enough market I will talk with the "owner" of the specs and see if he is willing to sell it (and lose our competitive advantage
) Doubt it though!
EVOlutionary
This Ohlins setup also has many many hours of R+D and computer modeling and shock dyno tuning over a period of more than 3 years. If there is a big enough market I will talk with the "owner" of the specs and see if he is willing to sell it (and lose our competitive advantage
) Doubt it though! EVOlutionary
May 1, 2007, 08:49 AM
#200
Would there be a market for multi-time National champion-spec autocross suspension? I can tell you that from what I've heard about Chronohunter's setup this should perform very similarly. Of course it is optimized for autocross, but I know it will do equally as well on the road course. I hope to prove that later this year at some NASA events.
This Ohlins setup also has many many hours of R+D and computer modeling and shock dyno tuning over a period of more than 3 years. If there is a big enough market I will talk with the "owner" of the specs and see if he is willing to sell it (and lose our competitive advantage ) Doubt it though!
EVOlutionary
This Ohlins setup also has many many hours of R+D and computer modeling and shock dyno tuning over a period of more than 3 years. If there is a big enough market I will talk with the "owner" of the specs and see if he is willing to sell it (and lose our competitive advantage
) Doubt it though! EVOlutionary
are you sure that these coilovers would do well on roadcourse?
and i wonder why there isn't a big custom coilover following in the evo community for autocross like there is in the s2k world
May 1, 2007, 09:49 AM
#201
i don't wanna sound outta line but i just _heard_ (from autocross guys) that most roadrace setups are no good for autocross because they're too stiff (this already sounds off to me but shrugs)
are you sure that these coilovers would do well on roadcourse?
and i wonder why there isn't a big custom coilover following in the evo community for autocross like there is in the s2k world
are you sure that these coilovers would do well on roadcourse?
and i wonder why there isn't a big custom coilover following in the evo community for autocross like there is in the s2k world
May 1, 2007, 09:55 AM
#202
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The thing that bothers me most about this situation is the potential for all the development time and effort to go to waste. I'd hate to see Paul & Joe's work go down the drain and the knowledge be lost.
May 1, 2007, 04:27 PM
#204
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about $500-1000 more than the Ohlins, but the shock is sourced from Koni.
In the mean time, with all these issues with the Ohlins, is it possible to get mine rebuilt and serviced? I got 50k miles on my last rebuild (including revalve to the vishnu spec) and I desprately need them rebuilt soon...
May 1, 2007, 04:35 PM
#205
http://zzyzxmotorsports.com/products/coilovers
about $500-1000 more than the Ohlins, but the shock is sourced from Koni.
In the mean time, with all these issues with the Ohlins, is it possible to get mine rebuilt and serviced? I got 50k miles on my last rebuild (including revalve to the vishnu spec) and I desprately need them rebuilt soon...
about $500-1000 more than the Ohlins, but the shock is sourced from Koni.
In the mean time, with all these issues with the Ohlins, is it possible to get mine rebuilt and serviced? I got 50k miles on my last rebuild (including revalve to the vishnu spec) and I desprately need them rebuilt soon...
May 1, 2007, 08:30 PM
#206
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I'd like to hear from a Dustin or Shiv on this, because I feel like the abruptness of this whole thing is slightly strange, seeing as how Vishnu and chronohunter put so much work into this setup.
I will be buying a full coilover suspension setup (bushings, bars, etc.) this summer, and was planning on getting the Vishnu setup. So I'd like to know what Vishnu is going to replace this with (if anything), and if not, what they recommend I get, because I trust Vishnu over any other Evo tuner out there now.
Thanks,
Luffy
I will be buying a full coilover suspension setup (bushings, bars, etc.) this summer, and was planning on getting the Vishnu setup. So I'd like to know what Vishnu is going to replace this with (if anything), and if not, what they recommend I get, because I trust Vishnu over any other Evo tuner out there now.
Thanks,
Luffy
May 1, 2007, 09:06 PM
#208
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Paul's setup is so good that I have just about thrown out all my old assumptions about how to make the EVO handle. With the vishnu spec ohlins, I can put the rear of the car anywhere I want at any point in a corner.
That's how different the vishnu spec ohlins are. I really hope this situation can be resolved because with this setup I think someone here could get a national championship.
I'd like to hear from a Dustin or Shiv on this, because I feel like the abruptness of this whole thing is slightly strange, seeing as how Vishnu and chronohunter put so much work into this setup.
I will be buying a full coilover suspension setup (bushings, bars, etc.) this summer, and was planning on getting the Vishnu setup. So I'd like to know what Vishnu is going to replace this with (if anything), and if not, what they recommend I get, because I trust Vishnu over any other Evo tuner out there now.
Thanks,
Luffy
I will be buying a full coilover suspension setup (bushings, bars, etc.) this summer, and was planning on getting the Vishnu setup. So I'd like to know what Vishnu is going to replace this with (if anything), and if not, what they recommend I get, because I trust Vishnu over any other Evo tuner out there now.
Thanks,
Luffy
Last edited by chrisw; May 1, 2007 at 09:09 PM.
May 1, 2007, 09:22 PM
#209
To get your Ohlins rebuilt (seals replaced and new fluid) try Motorsports Spares Inc. out of Indy. They do all the Ohlins for cars that turn left AND right. They can also revalve them to your specs. Talk with Greg Hazard. We just talked with him today to order some new springs. Works may do service also.
I know how my car handles on the street, onramps, offramps, and curvy roads. It is just my opinion (so far) that it would be good for road racing. We'll see if I'm right when I get out to an HPDE.
EVOlutionary
I know how my car handles on the street, onramps, offramps, and curvy roads. It is just my opinion (so far) that it would be good for road racing. We'll see if I'm right when I get out to an HPDE.
EVOlutionary
May 1, 2007, 09:52 PM
#210
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I'd like to hear from a Dustin or Shiv on this, because I feel like the abruptness of this whole thing is slightly strange, seeing as how Vishnu and chronohunter put so much work into this setup.
I will be buying a full coilover suspension setup (bushings, bars, etc.) this summer, and was planning on getting the Vishnu setup. So I'd like to know what Vishnu is going to replace this with (if anything), and if not, what they recommend I get, because I trust Vishnu over any other Evo tuner out there now.
Thanks,
Luffy
I will be buying a full coilover suspension setup (bushings, bars, etc.) this summer, and was planning on getting the Vishnu setup. So I'd like to know what Vishnu is going to replace this with (if anything), and if not, what they recommend I get, because I trust Vishnu over any other Evo tuner out there now.
Thanks,
Luffy