KevinD

iTrader: (56)

i'd like to add this to this discussion. this is from my experience installing dozens of these kits on evos with all sorts of turbo setups from stock, 50 trim, green, 30r, 35r, etc.


for most people, the issue is cost. the HFS1 is considerably cheaper the the HFS5 and that alone is a deciding factor for people.

beyond the issue of the cost of the kit, here is how i recommend the kits to people. if you are building the car to do any road racing, drivers ed, (i'd say autocross, but meth injection is illegal in all classes), rally or spirited driving where part throttle conditions are seen often, and how the car operates in those transient conditions is critical, then without a doubt the HFS5 is the kit you will want. if you are only looking to do drag racing/street racing with the car, and the car will primarily see only WOT runs, then the HFS1 is going to better suit you.

the reasoning behind this is, the HFS5 has a fuel injector amplifier which allows the high speed valve to control the meth flow rate based off the ecus IDC of the primary injectors. what this will do is keep the meth delivery more consistent with what load cell you are in on the fuel tables. more consistency means a smoother tune and more consistent AFR in transient conditions when your feathering the throttle around the apex of a turn, or gently rolling onto the throttle of an increasing radius turn. with the HFS5 you have to watch out for a few things though. one is because it follows IDC, you need to pick your primary injectors so that they use as much duty cycle as possible. if you are only reaching 50-60% duty cycle at WOT then you are not going to get the full advantage of the high speed valve. however if you are hitting 85-90% duty cycle, then the methanol will give a wide range of flow rates and give the very consistent AFR through the load cells and RPM ranges.

if the car is only going to see WOT runs, or the transient conditions are not as important, then the HFS1 is better suited. because there is only one flow rate for the HFS1 once it is setup, you will see a transition point in the fuel tables where the meth turns on. and you will always have either a semi lean or semi rich point at that transition point. generally, good tuning can work most of this out, but you can still see the transition visibly on a wideband log. think of it this way, if the kit it set to turn on around 15psi, at 15 psi you will see 1000cc/min of methanol, and at 30psi, you'll still have 1000cc/min of methanol. at 14 psi you will have 0cc/min of methanol. you can see the discontinuity (note* the kits are usually triggered off of IDC, not MAP, but MAP and Injector pulse width do follow very close. IDC will follow close at spoolup and increase as RPM increases). this kit is not Dependant on the size of your primary injectors either... if you run 880s or 550's it will still deliver the same amount of methanol. that is an advantage to this kit.

the price difference is about 250 dollars too, thats why many other aquamist dealers recommend the HFS1, less setup dependancy, and slightly easier install.

dudical26

iTrader: (17)

KevinD- That is a really great explanation and should help people choose between a 1 vs. 5

You have sold a bunch of kits, about what ratio has been HFS-1 vs. HFS5 ?

shunderwunder

iTrader: (41)

Thanx KevinD. That's the best explanation I've read. Looks like the HFC-5 is for me. I plan to do a hand full of track days & have been debating getting a meth kit. I think I'll be getting one of these soon.

Richard L

iTrader: (5)

KevinD - that was a great concise, practical write-up.

codean

iTrader: (8)

Parts list for upgrading hfs-1 to hfs-5 please?

Richard L

iTrader: (5)

Parts needed to upgrade HFS-1 to HFS-5:

1) FIA2 fuel injection amplifier (806-441)
2) High speed Valve (806-244) + fittings and clips.
3) 22cc surge arrestor/accumulator (806-409)
4) 5-port manifold (--)
5) 75mm SS worm drive clip (--)
6) 22cc accumulator support bracket (--)
7) 1/8 BSPM to 3/8BSPM adaptor (--)
8) 2x BSP blanking plugs.
9) 1 set of inline restrictor pills (--)
10) HFS-5 user manual (--)

Upgrade kit available direct from Aquamist UK only.

DynoFlash

iTrader: (91)

I prefer the HFS 1 for cars with stock turbos

Since the boost response on those applications spikes high at low rpms and then tapers down towards red line a IDC progressive kit in many cases gives a inverse supply of the alcohol which is actually needed

Cars with too small an injector using alcohol to compensate of cars with large turbos which hold full boost at high rpms work better with the HFS 5

Al

DynoFlash

iTrader: (91)

With skillful adjustment of the trigger point and fuel mapping you can make the transition nearly seamless as the alcohol comes on

of course with several nozzels the transition can become more difficult to feather

As I said above on stock turbo cars the HFS 1 is my choice 100%

On my STI which has run out of injector at high rpms I use the HFS 5 as high rpms fuelling is needed

The selction of the kit is needs to be made based upon the nature of the car's modification and the reasons why the customer is running an alcohol injection system

Al

shunderwunder

iTrader: (41)

Al, do you still recomend the HSF-1 for road course cars with stock turbo? What about the green? I guess I should give you an idea of what I plan to do with my car. Right now it is a full bolt on IX with 272's. I plan to go green-meth-AEM EMS in the future & not necessarily in that order. I drive the car when not going to & from work, so it's kind of a daily driver. I plan to do track days & a couple trips to the strip with it, but street driveability is a must. Any recomendations will help my future meth plans. I'll be doing Aquamist for sure, but now the question is which one. Price is not an issue, cause I'd rather hold out longer to get the right one for my needs.

FastAzzEvo

iTrader: (11)

I'm kind in the same situation of what kit to buy. Aquamist for sure, but which one.

Want meth to replace race gas for more boost and drag strip trips.

green/780cc/cams/bolt ons.

wartownracer

iTrader: (3)

yeah im in the same boat as my other 2 georgia boys. I am more than likely going to go with green aem and meth or maybe a 50trim. I dont do autocross or anything. I will go to the drag strip just once prolly to see what time i can put up. I will be doing spirited weekend drives around town. What do you guys suggest for me?

Itchy

iTrader: (20)

with a stock turbo on meth hfs1 will bigger injectors be necessary? i know once i upgrade to the green i will need injectors but unsure if i will need it for just the meth on stock turbo??