Jack_of_Trades

iTrader: (17)

Hey guys, been working on a new alky kit which will be controlled via the stock ECU (hackers rock...aka Tephra) and uses a fuel injector setup rather than a nozzle.

My question is, what are your IDEAL failsafes? Meaning, what features ARE on the market that you like and which ones are NOT on the market yet? I'll update this post with a list of failsafes as you guys list them. Any help is appreciated.

Alky kit info (hasn't been fully updated yet)

Jamie



FAILSAFES

• Low tank level
• Low or No fuel pressure (possible leak, possible clog, pump failure)
• Low fuel flow (possible leak, possible clog, possible faulty injector or pump)
• No fuel flow (failed injector, clog)
• Lean AFR (possible low flow or pressure, faulty injector)
• High EGT's (possible lean mixture)

*All failsafes will trigger a safer fuel/ignition and boost map

Richard L

iTrader: (5)

I think the first and foremost is "direct" monitoring the flow against a reference. All the "indirect" failsafes are the consequence of the "direct" method, why repeat it.

M50/W50 might show up well on the AFR unless your project is confined to 100% methanol.

Ultimate CC

iTrader: (122)

I personally think the best failsafe is an ecu, especially when it comes to something like an AEM...just can't beat that...

SlowCar

iTrader: (4)

the aem is as good as the tuner

a failsafe on the other hand, when there is a fault - acts to prevent the motor from destruction

Ultimate CC

iTrader: (122)

Good point but i never said anything about a tuner, just that for me personally you can't beat an ecu when it comes to a failsafe standpoint...whats better than having nearly all the values monitored at all times...

aqmist

iTrader: (6)

If the PCM ECM knows that the tune is based on a second fuel system being used and can except inputs then yes it works really really good. The best example I have seen is the Hydra system for the WRX's.

The stock PCM can deal with knock as these are calibrated frequency's that the PCM has been programmed to look for.......no auxiliary fuel systems being used. But on a car running a tuned lean fuel trim with an auxiliary methanol injection system that the PCM does not know about and possibly the tuner has raised boost over stock or taken stock control away, the PCM does not compensate well for methanol injection system failure in this instance. Yes it can see knock and pull timing but thats not the same thing for high boost, then sudden lean and high EGT.

Jack_of_Trades

iTrader: (17)

It is confined to any alcohol fuel, no water in this setup. No injector on the market can withstand the longterm effects of straight water at the moment. It was hard enough finding injectors that can withstand methanol or ethanol long term,lol.

This will use the stock ECU to control all failsafes that are triggered, as well as control the turn-on/turn-off point by a specified LOAD value, not a boost pressure.

I am disecting all of the IC sprayer inputs/outputs to find a suitable ECU input for flow monitoring. The Labonte Motorsports safeinjection unit has an output that increases voltage by .1v for every 100 cc/min, with this unit (or any other that has an output....DDS3?) you can tell the ECU how the system is performing. The alky injector runs the EXACT same IDC as the stock injectors so the ECU is already aware of those variables. I just need a table to enter in the alky kits static fuel pressure, and a formula that it follows to keep an eye on the IDC vs. FLOW.

This would be the ultimate in monitoring and the hardest part to make into a reality.

Since my control unit monitors all of the basic failsafes and simply triggers the safer FUEL/IGNITION and boost maps if any are triggered, I only need one ECU input to cover all of those bases. I simply need one more input for the flow monitoring. Then its just a matter of setting up a table in the ECU to watch things.

The plus side is that you can actually datalog these readings too if it gets implemented.

Richard L

iTrader: (5)

The DDS3's flow signal is 0.5v to 4.5V, scalable between 85-300cc/min to 100-1200cc /min per minute. The reason for the scaling is you can retain good resolution at all time.

Jack_of_Trades

iTrader: (17)

Well the Labonte unit is $139USD, and has a resolution of .1 to 2.4 volts I believe, from 100cc/min to 2500 cc/min. The DDS3 definitely has greater resolution (I'd need the 100 cc/min-1000cc/min scaling) but I couldn't find a cost on the DDS3 unit. Does it only come with the controller gauge?

aqmist

iTrader: (6)

The DDS3 is a gauge controller so to speak
$297.00
http://www.aquamist.co.uk/press/
top of the page click the link for the manual

Richard L

iTrader: (5)

The flow sensor is available separately (withiout gauge) at ~$138 #806-428.

Jack_of_Trades

iTrader: (17)

Excellent. Can AN fittings be incorported with this?

Richard L

iTrader: (5)

The two ends are 1/8BSP female - I am sure you can find a AN/BSP converter somewhere.


http://www.aquamist.co.uk/sl/plist/frm-4-USD.html

Jack_of_Trades

iTrader: (17)

Thanks man, these should do the job I suppse:

http://www.theperformancedriver.com/...productid=3720

aqmist

iTrader: (6)

Nice find on those fittings. As long as those fittings are not over torqued into the flow sensor (easy to do if use gorilla hands) I think there good.

Because of the way AN fittings work (needing to be very tight to make a seal) I was thinking that if you installed the fittings onto the lines first and then screwed in the assembly into the flow sensor you can better avoid possible damage to the sensor from over tightening.