***Official NV Chat Thread***
Aug 29, 2010, 10:35 PM
#3468
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its just a sunday version of the thursday aloha kitchen meet. Very chill people that just sit around and BS for a few hours. I was there tonight, was about 15 cars, I was the only awd there. Decent people show up there, never seen any drama since i have been going to those.
Aug 30, 2010, 10:32 AM
#3470
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i vouch for chris (20psiMR) on his tunes!!.....been running the same tune from him for the last 3 years with NO (0%) problems.....also i recommended 3 of my other friends to him after they got tuned by a local tuner on the dyno to fix there idle issues (car doesnt recover idle when you stop @ a red light) and mis-fire problem on different rpm's.....
Last edited by SinCityEvo9; Aug 30, 2010 at 10:35 AM.
Aug 30, 2010, 11:14 PM
#3473
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Someone who hides behind a screen name. And I have a buddy with a piston thats broken in half to prove Doug has blown up at least one evo and messed up countless others with injector scaling. That blew up WHILE he was tuning and ON his dyno. Did he replace it or offer any comensation? Not at all. Thats all I have to say.
Tunes never take me 4 hours. Ive had a few that needed injector scaling that took me 2 hours + because doug doesnt know what scaling is. When a car is running so pig rich it pops and bogs in boost, thats not right. When guys call me because they took their car to him a month ago, guys Ive never even met, and want me to fix it because their car is running like crap. Thats saying something. I dont claim to be the end all be all of tuning, or a "super tuner". Thats your claim apparently, but who have you tuned? Do you even own an evo? Does anyone even know you?
As far as the road tune is concerned, a dyno overly loads the motor. On the street is where the car is driven, in real world, with the correct air flow going through the intercooler and the correct load on the motor. The rollers do a close job at simulating rolling resistance, which is what they were built for. It will never be 100%, you have that statement completely backwards.
Yes, I use a modified JDM mivec map with more timing through the curve. No secret there. Ive seen dougs tunes where the map wasnt changed from stock. I have a custom map for cams that you apparently havent seen (or stolen). My timing maps are smooth, I pride myself on that. We can have a pissing match all day long from what Ive seen coming from Dougs shop and what he has seen from me. Honestly I dont care. This is the last I'll comment, as you guys know I dont really hit this forum too much any more so I dont want to make a ton of waves. If you have more to say, feel free but Im not even going to come back and look. I know I do good work, Ive been told by many people they are very happy with how their car runs and thats good enough for me. I do it for them, not to make myself look good and keep a shop afloat. Honestly if doug learned how to tune and wasnt jacking up peoples cars I would have quit long ago, but I feel for the Vegas community since they dont have anyone to turn to when their cars are running like crap.
Tunes never take me 4 hours. Ive had a few that needed injector scaling that took me 2 hours + because doug doesnt know what scaling is. When a car is running so pig rich it pops and bogs in boost, thats not right. When guys call me because they took their car to him a month ago, guys Ive never even met, and want me to fix it because their car is running like crap. Thats saying something. I dont claim to be the end all be all of tuning, or a "super tuner". Thats your claim apparently, but who have you tuned? Do you even own an evo? Does anyone even know you?
As far as the road tune is concerned, a dyno overly loads the motor. On the street is where the car is driven, in real world, with the correct air flow going through the intercooler and the correct load on the motor. The rollers do a close job at simulating rolling resistance, which is what they were built for. It will never be 100%, you have that statement completely backwards.
Yes, I use a modified JDM mivec map with more timing through the curve. No secret there. Ive seen dougs tunes where the map wasnt changed from stock. I have a custom map for cams that you apparently havent seen (or stolen). My timing maps are smooth, I pride myself on that. We can have a pissing match all day long from what Ive seen coming from Dougs shop and what he has seen from me. Honestly I dont care. This is the last I'll comment, as you guys know I dont really hit this forum too much any more so I dont want to make a ton of waves. If you have more to say, feel free but Im not even going to come back and look. I know I do good work, Ive been told by many people they are very happy with how their car runs and thats good enough for me. I do it for them, not to make myself look good and keep a shop afloat. Honestly if doug learned how to tune and wasnt jacking up peoples cars I would have quit long ago, but I feel for the Vegas community since they dont have anyone to turn to when their cars are running like crap.
OK, first: why do you keep referencing Doug? What does he have to do with you're inability to grasp what I'm telling you? Stop tuning, since you don't know what your doing. Thats all, simple as that.
Second: What does it matter what car I'm driving? You don't have an evo. What does it matter if I do?
Third: Its obvious by your statement on road tuning vs dyno tuning and that you have such a firm grasp on what a dyno is used for
. When using load vs rpm tables, which are what most tuning software is based around, how can you justify that on a dyno the car is not getting "the correct air flow going through the intercooler and the correct load on the motor?" "Airflow through the intercooler" is just to keep the heat transfer in effect to cool the charge air coming from the turbo on its way to the intake manifold. The fans used in dyno situations help keep the intercooler (among other things) cool and a proper temperature, if you monitor the iat and coolant temp like you should, you'd know that. Load is a measurment of air that the engine takes in. So if you are under wide open throttle and the engine is seeing 250kpa of air on a dyno, how would 250kpa of air while running on the street be any different?Fourth: The 100% I'm talking about is being able to have an actual grasp on what your changes made to the calibration file are actually doing to performance. Sure the a/f ratio may look smooth and there may be almost no knock, but how do you know what changes you are making are helping or hurting anything? Adding timing may add 10-15hp, or moving the cam settings could be hurting midrange, but can you really be sure it is? Not based off of some simulation or assumption but off of an accurate measurement of acceleration?
Fifth: Maybe your "tuning sessions" don't normally take 4hrs, I don't know. The person I heard this from specifically claimed 4hrs, road tuning between here and sloan back and forth , for so long he was worried he was going to run out of fuel. That just sounds sad to me.
Sixth: Since you believe I "hide behind a computer screen" I'd love to have a sitdown discussion with you on tuning principles, in person. I'll be working out of town this week and next weekend, but I'll be back in town in time for that next Thursday's meet. Since you'll be in town that weekend, I'll see you there
Aug 31, 2010, 05:09 PM
#3478
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lol this is so funny, I dont even know where to start.
OK, first: why do you keep referencing Doug? What does he have to do with you're inability to grasp what I'm telling you? Stop tuning, since you don't know what your doing. Thats all, simple as that.
Second: What does it matter what car I'm driving? You don't have an evo. What does it matter if I do?
Third: Its obvious by your statement on road tuning vs dyno tuning and that you have such a firm grasp on what a dyno is used for. When using load vs rpm tables, which are what most tuning software is based around, how can you justify that on a dyno the car is not getting "the correct air flow going through the intercooler and the correct load on the motor?" "Airflow through the intercooler" is just to keep the heat transfer in effect to cool the charge air coming from the turbo on its way to the intake manifold. The fans used in dyno situations help keep the intercooler (among other things) cool and a proper temperature, if you monitor the iat and coolant temp like you should, you'd know that. Load is a measurment of air that the engine takes in. So if you are under wide open throttle and the engine is seeing 250kpa of air on a dyno, how would 250kpa of air while running on the street be any different?
Fourth: The 100% I'm talking about is being able to have an actual grasp on what your changes made to the calibration file are actually doing to performance. Sure the a/f ratio may look smooth and there may be almost no knock, but how do you know what changes you are making are helping or hurting anything? Adding timing may add 10-15hp, or moving the cam settings could be hurting midrange, but can you really be sure it is? Not based off of some simulation or assumption but off of an accurate measurement of acceleration?
Fifth: Maybe your "tuning sessions" don't normally take 4hrs, I don't know. The person I heard this from specifically claimed 4hrs, road tuning between here and sloan back and forth , for so long he was worried he was going to run out of fuel. That just sounds sad to me.
Sixth: Since you believe I "hide behind a computer screen" I'd love to have a sitdown discussion with you on tuning principles, in person. I'll be working out of town this week and next weekend, but I'll be back in town in time for that next Thursday's meet. Since you'll be in town that weekend, I'll see you there
OK, first: why do you keep referencing Doug? What does he have to do with you're inability to grasp what I'm telling you? Stop tuning, since you don't know what your doing. Thats all, simple as that.
Second: What does it matter what car I'm driving? You don't have an evo. What does it matter if I do?
Third: Its obvious by your statement on road tuning vs dyno tuning and that you have such a firm grasp on what a dyno is used for
. When using load vs rpm tables, which are what most tuning software is based around, how can you justify that on a dyno the car is not getting "the correct air flow going through the intercooler and the correct load on the motor?" "Airflow through the intercooler" is just to keep the heat transfer in effect to cool the charge air coming from the turbo on its way to the intake manifold. The fans used in dyno situations help keep the intercooler (among other things) cool and a proper temperature, if you monitor the iat and coolant temp like you should, you'd know that. Load is a measurment of air that the engine takes in. So if you are under wide open throttle and the engine is seeing 250kpa of air on a dyno, how would 250kpa of air while running on the street be any different?Fourth: The 100% I'm talking about is being able to have an actual grasp on what your changes made to the calibration file are actually doing to performance. Sure the a/f ratio may look smooth and there may be almost no knock, but how do you know what changes you are making are helping or hurting anything? Adding timing may add 10-15hp, or moving the cam settings could be hurting midrange, but can you really be sure it is? Not based off of some simulation or assumption but off of an accurate measurement of acceleration?
Fifth: Maybe your "tuning sessions" don't normally take 4hrs, I don't know. The person I heard this from specifically claimed 4hrs, road tuning between here and sloan back and forth , for so long he was worried he was going to run out of fuel. That just sounds sad to me.
Sixth: Since you believe I "hide behind a computer screen" I'd love to have a sitdown discussion with you on tuning principles, in person. I'll be working out of town this week and next weekend, but I'll be back in town in time for that next Thursday's meet. Since you'll be in town that weekend, I'll see you there
When the car is on the dyno and they do the tuning, they do tunes for ~11.5.. the sniffer reads 11.5 and my wideband reads 11.5. I leave the shop and do some pull son the way home to see how the car feels on the road and the car ALWAYS run at least .5 ( half a point ) richer once the car is on the road. Now I have always assumed it was the difference in static air on the dyno vs actual moving air on the road, but as you state it is the same thing. Yes the dyno uses fans that are moving air at a contstant rate vs the car moving air at changing rates. But I am not an expert, can you please explain why I see the same differnce in the 10 different dyno sessions I have done with my car?